[Fishin' Pat]

This question has puzzled me for a while. I use a medium heavy spinning rod, which has served me well and has good backbone. However, a guy I know at LA uses a medium weight and casts 20 ft more than me every time. What bothers me is that that extra 20 ft brings in twice as many fish as me....is it the rod weight that makes the cast go far?

 

[Busse Jim]

you get a little more SPRING with the lighter rod, but you can get better distance with heavier lures. more sreamlined lures, and i think you get more distance with braided lines too. theres a lot of variables that contribute

 

[Navyfisher]

There are so many factors to consider, reel, line, lure, etc. It goes on and on.
I'll let you in on a little secret. While it is nice to cast the distance, most the time the fish are closer than you think.

 

[stinkb8]

There are so many factors to consider, reel, line, lure, etc. It goes on and on.
I'll let you in on a little secret. While it is nice to cast the distance, most the time the fish are closer than you think.

x2

 

[Handler]

Grab some Nanofil you'll pick up those 20 ft. and then some.

 

[catchafew]

I'm with Navy Fisher and BigSlick on, far too many factors to consider. I will generally say that with longer rods you will get better casting distances but longer rods have their pro's and con's like everything else.

 

[Fishin' Pat]

I use a Shimano Spirex 2500RG Rear drag spinning reel, a Shimano Voltaeus 6'6" medium-heavy spinning rod, 10 lb test Berkley Trilene mono and I generally throw 1/4 oz lipless cranks at this time of year. He has a Falcon 6'6" medium spinning rod with a Shimano spinning reel (not sure about the rod or reel models, but I know the rod is a Falcon and the reel is a Shimano spinning reel). I'm not sure what kind of line he uses. Hope that helps. :?

 

[Rooger]

In this respect, rods are very similar to golf clubs. In golf, you try to optimally match the shaft flex to a player's swing speed and club head weight. The end result is getting the club to "load up" during the backswing and downswing and to release maximum energy or speed at impact. Players that use shafts that are too stiff for their swing speed will never generate enough flex to get the proper whip action at release. Players that use clubs that are too flexible can occasionally time the release just right to create the perfect impact, but it's very difficult to control. A lot of your "long-drive" contest competitors will use extra long, super whippy shafts, but they can be all over the place if not timed absolutely perfect.

When fishing with light to medium action rods, I can cast lightweight lures much further, however as I get to 1/2 oz or more, the odds of getting the right flex in the rod combined with the best accuracy definitely favor a heavier action. The heavier the bait, the more backbone you'll need in the rod. As mentioned earlier, there are many more factors involved as well.

 

[BrookfieldAngler]

Have you ever asked to cast his? As valid as everybody's equipment theories are, the human element could be the biggest culprit of all. If you switch set-ups with him and he continues to outcast you, then chances are that the human element are to blame. If you switch and start outcasting him, then it's a difference in equipment.

 

[SpecialEd]

In this respect, rods are very similar to golf clubs. In golf, you try to optimally match the shaft flex to a player's swing speed and club head weight. The end result is getting the club to "load up" during the backswing and downswing and to release maximum energy or speed at impact. Players that use shafts that are too stiff for their swing speed will never generate enough flex to get the proper whip action at release. Players that use clubs that are too flexible can occasionally time the release just right to create the perfect impact, but it's very difficult to control. A lot of your "long-drive" contest competitors will use extra long, super whippy shafts, but they can be all over the place if not timed absolutely perfect.

When fishing with light to medium action rods, I can cast lightweight lures much further, however as I get to 1/2 oz or more, the odds of getting the right flex in the rod combined with the best accuracy definitely favor a heavier action. The heavier the bait, the more backbone you'll need in the rod. As mentioned earlier, there are many more factors involved as well.

Spot on.

I would also like to add blank and guide ring insert material (or lack thereof) & guide type/placement into the equation.

While on the surface a Shimano Voltaeus may appear to be a great rod considering the Shimano name and warranty, but when you look at it in comparison to the Falcon, it falls short. The Voltaeus is a 3 material composite blend with carbon & t-glass being the two most significant. The Falcon rods, as far as I know are all graphite rods. The addition of glass in a rod blank will slow the action of the rod down. Basically it will make the rod bend more and further down from the tip during a cast when compared to a graphite blank of the same power.

What this means during a cast is the rod will load up faster with less weight, but will require better timing to be more accurate. It also means that your rod will resonate or continue to flex more after your lure is released. While your line is running through the guides on a cast this added vibration will cause line slap along the blank and added friction against the guides effectively slowing down the lure at the end of your line.

Another thing to consider is guide ring material. The Voltaeus rods use a stainless ring vs. the Falcons that use a Fuji (ring type unspecified) guide. I would venture to guess based upon price alone that Falcon uses Alconite or SiC ring Fuji guides which are outstanding IMHO.

What rings do is provide a smooth surface for your line to run through. In the old days it was thought that any old smooth surface would be fine as long as it was free of nicks or burrs. What manufacturers have found since then is that materials with an extremely low coefficient of friction will actually increase casting distance, prevent premature line wear, and the lighter weight materials prove to hamper the action of the blank less. On a Vickers scale, Alconite and SiC are among the highest rated for hardness. This means the material is extremely dense and therefore in it's polished state, extremely smooth.

Guide placement is my last rant. :lol: - There are many ways of determining proper spacing and application of guides on a fishing rod. I subscribe to the New Guide Concept put forth by Fuji. I have done enough research and seen enough evidence on the water first hand to know that this method of guide type and placement plays a significant role in the practical performance of a fishing rod. I could go into the specifics, but I don't think anyone reading this right now needs a nap. Basically the New Guide Concept calls for more guides (specifically smaller guides in the final section of the guide train), guide rings closer to the blank and better following the natural bend of the rod under load, and specific stripper guide (first guide above reel) placement based upon the angle of the reel axis.

It's based much more soundly on science than the old way which was to lay them out so they look even. :lol:

 

[Tikimahn]

As everyone's said casting distance is directly related to several factors. A Medium action rod from one company may be stiffer with a faster action(whippier tip) while another companies may totally different, so it's not so much about the Weight or action of the rod but rather the tip. Reel's are a huge factor in distance, as well as lure weight and design. Line guides and Line also play into it. Lastly it's about form and power. He could have better form or just more power than you. Though I tend to think power probably factors into the scenario the least as you can find ways to counteract a lack of power with a rod that will load up more.

Try his setup see if you get the same results... If not it's you, and not your equipment.

 

[SpecialEd]

Rick you are mostly correct. Fast or extra fast action means the majority of the bend in the rod occurs closer to the tip. As the rod rating goes from fast to moderate to slow the majority of the bend moves further back down the rod towards the reel seat.

I have seen fast action 9' rods that are still pretty whippy... just in the top 25% of the rod though.

:idea:

 

[Charged]

Grab some Nanofil you'll pick up those 20 ft. and then some.

:thumbup: :thumbup:

It does make a difference, Started using it last year on my ultralight on a glass rod. Could really whip the small stuff out there pretty far. I'd like to play around with it some more and try a heavier test nano sometime this next year.

 

[Fishin' Pat]

Thanks for all the advice and insight guys. Next time I see him, I'll try out his setup and see whether it really is me and not my equipment. SpecialEd, if you were in my position, and it was your gear and not you, what are some rods you would recommend based on this:

Another thing to consider is guide ring material. The Voltaeus rods use a stainless ring vs. the Falcons that use a Fuji (ring type unspecified) guide. I would venture to guess based upon price alone that Falcon uses Alconite or SiC ring Fuji guides which are outstanding IMHO.

Fishin' Pat

 

[SpecialEd]

Pat,

What is your budget and what kind of fishing do you like to do?

St. Croix Triumphs can be had for $60 or $70 and are built on excellent blanks with fine Fuji guides.

I also happen to know a guy that builds custom rods too if you were interested in something built to your specifications. :wink:

 

[Fishin' Pat]

SpecialEd:

Bass fishing. Period. It's my absolute favorite and it's all I do. My budget would be anything $100 or less; those St Croix's fall into that category. A custom rod might be neat...could you PM me the details?

Fishin' Pat